Mel Robbins has heard of the “make them” theory. In fact, she says she’s been trying it for years.
And it “does not work,” she tells TODAY.com backstage at Studio 1A Oct. 28.
In this season of “Nobody Wants This,” Morgan (Justine Lupe) goes viral for a solo episode of the podcast she usually co-hosts with her sister, Joanne (Kristen Bell). Riffing on Robbins’ “let them” theory, she proposes an alternative: Make them.
“Let them,” which is also the name of Robbins’ blockbuster book, is a type of surrender based on stoicism and ancient philosophy, Robbins says. In a previous interview with TODAY.com, she said the concept allows you to “see people exactly as they are instead of stressing yourself out wishing they were different.”
Morgan’s “make them” theory is exactly that opposite. Rather than let people do what they want, you make them do as you want.
Robbins watched “Nobody Wants This” and was moved by the apparent reference, because she says it’s proof her book is now “part of culture.”
Below, Robbins unpacks “make them” vs. “let them,” her new People Magazine cover and whether her three kids take her famous advice in conversation with TODAY.com.
What do you make of the ‘make them’ theory?
I have used the “make them” method for 54 years. I have tried to make them do the dishes, make them lose weight, make them change their mind, make them go to therapy, make them do their homework, and that does not work. What ends up happening when you try to make somebody change is they resist the thing you’re making them do.
I think it’s amazing and fun and funny, but it’s the way we’re all going through life right now, which is why we’re all so stressed out and why we’re all frustrated in our relationships and with other people.
I find it’s much more strategic to work with the neuroscience, and just let people have the dignity of their own experience. Let people reveal who they are to you, and let them see your example. A funny thing happens, and this isn’t my theory, it’s actual hard science. When somebody has the space to sit with themselves, and when somebody does not feel pressured to change, they suddenly believe it’s their idea. They suddenly have room to step toward the things that you’ve been b----- about forever, because nobody wants to be told, “I told you so.”
When you heard about the ‘make them’ theory on the show, were you flattered?
I love the show, and I love everybody on it, and I was super flattered. I have created a simple theory that explains stoicism and radical acceptance and Buddhism and the serenity prayer, because that’s what the “let them” theory is.
When you see people not only apply it, but it becomes part of culture ... you see people make jokes about it — you know you have shared something that is of value. If it’s something simple, if it works, if it’s sticky, so people can remember it, that’s what makes for a really good idea.
You have three kids. Do they listen to you?
No, absolutely not. I’m their mother. Why would they listen to me? They are biologically engineered to argue against and resist everything I try to make them do. I have learned the single best piece of advice in my 50s that I wish I had had when I was born, and it’s this. Every parent should just repeat this sentence: Do you want my advice, or do you just want me to listen? Ninety-nine percent of the time, your children and everybody in your life just wants you to listen.
But no, my children don’t listen to me.
I should listen to my mom more. She’s always right.
You cannot tell somebody the lesson they have to learn by failing or experiencing the pain of doing it your way. You just can’t. Some lessons cannot be transferred through language. They have to be learned through experience.
As moms in particular, we’re trying to prevent you from experiencing the pain that we’ve experienced. The irony is, the exact pain you need to learn the lesson, we can’t teach.
You’re holding your new People magazine cover. How does it feel?
We’re a couple days away from Halloween right now. It feels like I’m in a costume. I’ve never imagined a moment where I would be on the cover of People.
To see something this big happen in my career, and to know that it’s happening because of all of the work that I did to change myself and become a person that is someone that I’m proud of, and then just sharing what I’m learning to be celebrated for the work that we can all do to change our lives — that’s incredible.
I’m just very proud. I’m so happy that the 41-year-old depressed, insecure, jealous, loser version of me got herself together and decided that she was worth working on, and her life was worth making better. Inside each of us, there is the desire to thrive. There is the desire to contribute. There is the desire to be happy. And I hope, in some small way, that this article and seeing how far one person can come in their life in 15, 16 years, and the positive difference that you can make — I hope it inspires somebody to make a decision to make their life better while they can.
Part of what’s inspirational about your story is that you didn’t just wake up wise.
I woke up dumb every day. Really dumb. If you think about it, if you’re really honest with yourself, there are things that you’re doing right now that are dumb, and they’re embarrassing. If you really stop and say, “OK, I can do better. I can take better care of myself. I can learn how to have a positive attitude. I don’t have to hang out with negative idiots. ... The time I’m spending complaining and feeling sorry for myself is time I could actually invest in changing my mindset and my habits.”
When you do that, you immediately become a different person. The results take time, but you start to feel differently the moment you act differently. I think that’s what shocked me the most. I stayed miserable for a long time. It’s pretty surprising how different and how much better you can feel in a very short period of time simply by changing how you act every day.
