Former President Jimmy Carter, who turns 80 this October, recently talked with “Today” host Katie Couric in Atlanta, Ga. They discussed the war in Iraq, whether Carter thinks the world is safer without Saddam Hussein in power and the upcoming U.S. presidential elections.
Saddam Hussein and the Iraq elections
Jimmy Carter: Well, the world is safer without Saddam. Certainly the people of Iraq are better without Saddam. I never have believed that Saddam Hussein was a direct threat to the security of the United States or Great Britain or China or Japan or Australia.
Katie Couric: But what about a “grave and gathering threat,” as President Bush has said?
Carter: That was a false statement. It was false to state that Saddam Hussein had a vast store of weapons of mass destruction or that Iraq was a direct threat to the security of the United States. The war has been unnecessary. And now I think we've reached a point in Iraq that it's become a quagmire — very similar to what we experienced in Vietnam. There's no real extrication, for us to accomplish the goals that we had when we went in. I think a lot of the violence in Iraq now is directly attributable to the fact that U.S. forces are there. And there's no clear concept at any early stage of when they will be withdrawn. I personally do not believe they're going to be ready for the election in January. But I think we should go through with the election and as soon as there's some tangible semblance of a democratic government in Iraq, get us out of there.”
Couric: But turning Iraq into a democracy is a good thing to you?
Carter: I think that's a very admirable thing, sure. You could list 50 countries in the world that don't have democracies, and it would be better if they all had democracies. But to attack a country almost unilaterally and waste away the almost universal global support and friendship and alliances that we had after the tragedy of 9/11 is what has been done.
Couric: Why do you think the elections are in such perilous shape?
Carter: Because there's no security there. You know, we just finished, the Carter Center did, our 52nd election. All of our elections have been in troubled countries where the outcome was doubtful. But in every case there has to be a central government that can set up the constitution and bylaws and rules so that an election can be held peacefully. I don't see that happening as long as the terrible violence continues in Iraq. And if you look at the statistics on deaths or wounded and so forth in the last three or four months — instead of getting better and more peaceful, apparently the situation's getting worse.
How Kerry can counter the ‘flip-flop’ attackCouric: President Bush and Vice President Cheney have portrayed Senator Kerry as a flip-flopper who lacks the resolve to successfully wage the war on terror. Whether you agree with that assessment or not, that strategy seems to be resonating among Americans, according to the polls. How does Senator Kerry counter that, in your view?
Carter: Well, I agree with your premise that this attack on Senator Kerry has had very serious consequences for him in the opinion of the public. I know from experience that circumstances change and the knowledge that you have about an event changes. And when the times change and the circumstances change or when you learn more information, it's natural for a strong leader to say, “Okay, my previous commitments, my previous statements were erroneous.” I think what Senator Kerry needs to do between now and the election is first of all take advantage of the three debates … also to let the people know that under changed circumstances he would do differently if he were in the White House. And that's, I think, the task that he has. It's not an easy task to overcome that stigma of flip-flopping. But everybody has to change position to accommodate changing times.
In the second part of the interview, Katie Couric begins by asking former President Carter if he has plans to slow down as he approaches his 80th birthday.
Carter: When I reach retirement age I certainly intend to do that, but I haven't decided what year that's going to be. As a matter of fact, I'm only 80 and I think I still have a few productive years left in me.
Couric: When I take a look at the activities you've been engaged in for the last 25 years or so, the word that comes to mind is peripatetic. And I looked it up in Webster's Dictionary and one of the definitions is “journey hither and thither” …
Carter: That's right.
Couric: … words you don't hear very often.
Carter: Or “ubiquitous,” which means “everywhere.”
Couric: Yeah, exactly.
Carter: It seems that way. Well, since the 1st of July we've been to Indonesia to help hold an election, we've been to Russia, we’ve been to Alaska, we've been to Guyana and we've been to Venezuela – all extremely challenging and adventurous and interesting opportunities for the Carter Center to serve.
The Carter Center, which Jimmy Carter started after leaving the White House, is currently operating in some 65 countries. One of its missions is health care. The center has dramatically decreased river blindness, which plagues many people in Third World countries.
Carter: Last year we treated 9.4 million people, and none of them will ever go blind.
Another success: The Center is close to eradicating the debilitating Guinea Worm Disease.
The Carter Center: striving for peace
The Center's peace programs focus on ending human rights abuses, monitoring elections and diffusing volatile conflicts — often in political hot spots.
Couric: What do you say to people who say, “Jimmy Carter has no business doing this”?
Carter: The Carter Center has always gone just to fill vacuums in the world. And when we do go to those controversial places — Haiti [and] North Korea are two notable examples — I wouldn't have gone without getting permission first from the White House, and I have done that.
Couric: Some people say you shouldn't be negotiating with dictators who are heinous human-rights violators.
Carter: Well, with whom do you negotiate? With leaders who are at peace? With leaders who are eager to give their people democracy? With leaders who are willing to honor all the elements of human rights? With leaders who are not abusive? You know, there's nothing to negotiate. So we do deal with some unsavory characters. But I think always with the best interests at heart.
The new style of ‘vitriolic’ politics
When it comes to choosing leaders in this country, the former president is also keeping an eye on and speaking out about the current race for the White House. He recently wrote an editorial stating that Florida was not ready for this election.
Carter: What do you think of this campaign? Have politics become more vitriolic?
Carter: Oh, yes.
Couric: Zell Miller gave a speech at the Republican National Convention [and] you wrote a scathing letter to him.
Carter: I thought it was a constructive letter. [Laughter]I went on to quote Zell Miller as having previously identified John Kerry as a true war hero whom he admired. You know, he changed his position in order to make that vitriolic speech. Campaigns in general around this country have become increasingly partisan and vitriolic in nature. Quite dramatically different from when I ran for president. I never referred to President Reagan or President Ford as anything except “my distinguished opponent.” And if I had orchestrated directly or indirectly a personal attack on their basic character, it would have been suicidal for me. Unfortunately, in the last 20 [to] 25 years those negative advertisements have become very effective. And of course they've been used I think to some degree on both sides — it’s regrettable.
One great ex-president?
Couric: I know it really bugs you when people say what a great ex-president you've been. [Laughter] That does bug you, I know it does. And I think it bugs Rosalynn as well, because you believe it's implicit in that comment that you weren't a great president.
Carter: Well, greatness is one thing. I kept our nation at peace and I protected our country's interests and I promoted peace around the world: We had the best environmental record in history, we doubled the size of our national park system [and] we tripled the size of our wilderness area. The only successful agreement that's ever been worked out in the Middle East, unfortunately, was the one I was able to accomplish in ’79, that treaty between Israel and Egypt. We were afflicted by the hostages being held and we were afflicted by the international high inflation rate that affected us and everybody else.
The Iranian hostage crisis
Couric: The hostage crisis in Iran has become in some ways symbolic of your presidency.
Carter: That's true.
Couric: Fifty-two Americans held hostage for 444 days.
Carter: You remember. I had two goals at the very beginning when the hostages were taken — paramount above everything else. One was to protect the interests and integrity of my country. And the other goal was to bring every hostage home safe and free. Both goals were completely accomplished.
After 444 days of negotiations, all 52 American hostages were released just minutes after Ronald Reagan was sworn in as president.
Carter: I would say that was one of the happiest and most joyful and thankful times of my life, and if they had come out, you know, five minutes earlier, before I left office, it would have been nicer in retrospect. But it wouldn't have changed the fate of the hostages.
A ‘challenging and gratifying life’
Couric: You once said of your years post-White House, “I feel truer to myself. I'm more a missionary than a politician. I am really where I belong. I don't have anything to fear now.”
Carter: Well, I don't have anything to fear. I would like to spend more time at home in Plains. I'd like to spend more time with our family. I would like to be known, you know, at least among 11 people, as a good grandfather and I would like to be known as a good husband, a good father. I'm still going to write books. I've begun oil painting. I'm becoming a better painter every year. I still make furniture. I still take care of the farmland that's been in our family since 1833.
Couric: Is there anything you don't do?
Carter: Well there are some things I want to do better so … we have a good time and a challenging, gratifying life.
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