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updated 10/15/2012 12:24:32 PM ET 2012-10-15T16:24:32

THE ED SHOW with ED SCHULTZ
October 12, 2012

Guests: Terry O`Neill, Leo Gerard

ED SCHULTZ, HOST: Good evening, Americans. Welcome to THE ED SHOW,
live from Minneapolis.

When you stand with middle class workers, you can`t lose, and he ain`t
no ordinary Joe. Joe Biden proved that last night. And as Winston
Churchill once said, I like a man who grins when he fights.

This is THE ED SHOW -- let`s get to work.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JOSEPH BIDEN, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: These are the
folks who talk about 47 percent of the American people being unwilling to
take responsibility.

It`s about time Governor Romney takes some responsibility.

SCHULTZ (voice-over): The vice president keeps the hits coming after
his knockout debate with Paul Ryan.

BIDEN: Stop talking about how you care about people. Show me
something.

SCHULTZ: Richard Wolffe on the education of Congressman Paul Ryan.

REP. PAUL RYAN (R-WI), VICE PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: Ronald Reagan --

BIDEN: Now you`re Jack Kennedy?

RYAN: Ronald Reagan --

SCHULTZ: NOW`s Terry O`Neill on the Romney ticket`s disaster for
women.

MARTHA RADDATZ, MODERATOR: If the Romney/Ran ticket is elected,
should those that believe abortion should remain legal be worried?

SCHULTZ: David Cay Johnston on Ryan`s sixth study lie.

RADDATZ: Can you guarantee this math will add up?

RYAN: Absolutely. Six studies have guaranteed.

SCHULTZ: And what`s more disrespectful? Lying to America or
interrupting a guy who`s lying to America?

CHRIS WALLACE, FOX NEWS: It was openly contemptuous and
disrespectful.

SCHULTZ: Karen Finney on the right wing freak-out over Joe Biden`s
knockout performance.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Ever felt that way where you just want to deck
somebody?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: An obnoxious drunk. I think somewhere during the
debate, he took Ritalin.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What a jack (EXPLETIVE DELETED)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Whoa!

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SCHULTZ: Good to have you with us tonight, folks. Thanks for
watching.

What did we see? We witnessed a schooling on the issues by Vice
President Joe Biden last night. It really was the shot in the arm the
Democrats and the progressives were hoping for.

After watching Mitt Romney get away with lie after lie last week, the
vice president wasn`t putting up with it from a guy who`s number two on the
Republican ticket.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RYAN: When we equivocate on our values, when we show that we`re
cutting our own defense, it makes us more weak. It projects weakness.
When we look weak, our adversaries are much more willing to test us, the
more brazen their attacks, and our allies are less willing to --

BIDEN: With all due respect, that`s a bunch of malarkey.

RADDATZ: Why is that so?

BIDEN: Because not a single thing he said is accurate.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Biden never took his foot off the gas. In one brief
sentence, the vice president summed up the empty rhetoric of the Romney
campaign.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BIDEN: Stop talking about how you care about people. Show me
something. Show me a policy. Show me a policy where you take
responsibility.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Many Obama supporters were disappointed the president didn`t
hold Mitt Romney accountable for this 47 percent comments and his economic
policies in general. Vice President Joe Biden made up for it last night.
He used 68 seconds to say exactly what needed to be said about the
Romney/Ryan view of the middle class in this country.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BIDEN: Romney said, no, let Detroit go bankrupt. We moved in and
helped people refinance their homes. Governor Romney said, no, let
foreclosures hit the bottom.

But it shouldn`t be surprising for a guy who says 47 percent of the
American people are unwilling to take responsibility for their own lives.
My friend recently in a speech in Washington said 30 percent of the
American people are takers.

These people are my mom and dad, the people I grew up with, my
neighbors. They pay more effective tax than Governor Romney pays in his
federal income tax. They are elderly people who, in fact, are living off
of Social Security.

They are veterans and people fighting in Afghanistan right now who
are, quote, "not paying any taxes." I`ve had it up to here with this
notion that 47 percent -- it`s about time they take some responsibility
here. And instead of signing pledges to Grover Norquist not to ask the
wealthiest among us to contribute to bring back the middle class, they
should be signing a pledge saying to the middle class, we`re going to level
the playing field. We`re going to give you a fair shot again. We are
going to not repeat the mistakes we made in the past by having a different
set of rules for Wall Street and Main Street.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: That sound bite right there by Joe Biden made Paul Ryan look
out of his league a number of times in the debate, but especially right
there.

When Paul Ryan criticized the stimulus plan, Biden`s response was
devastating.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BIDEN: I love my friend here. I`m not allowed to show letters, but
go on our website. He sent me two letters saying, by the way, can you send
me some stimulus money for companies in the state of Wisconsin? We sent
millions of dollars.

RADDATZ: You did ask for stimulus money, correct?

BIDEN: Sure he did.

RYAN: On two occasions we advocated for constituents applying for
grants. That`s what we do. We do that for all constituents.

BIDEN: I love that. I love that. This is such a brad program and he
writes the Department of Energy a letter saying the reason we need this
stimulus, it will create growth and jobs. His words. And now he`s sitting
here looking at me.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: We do that for all constituents? That`s what Paul Ryan
said? So in other words if somebody comes into his office and says, hey, I
need $20 million for this project, it`s just a quick stamp of approval?

Ryan`s part of the problem in Washington, and he`s trying to blame the
Democrats for it. At certain points the vice president was openly fact
checking Paul Ryan`s comments in real time.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RYAN: This is a plan that`s bipartisan. It`s a plan I put together
with a prominent Democrat senator from Oregon.

BIDEN: There`s not one Democrat who endorses it. Not one Democrat
who signed the plan.

RYAN: Our partner is a Democrat from Oregon.

BIDEN: He says he does no longer support --

RYAN: We put it together with the former Clinton budget director.

BIDEN: Who disavows it.

RYAN: This idea came from the Clinton commission to save Medicare
chaired by Senator John Breaux. Here`s the point, Martha --

BIDEN: Which was rejected.

RYAN: -- if we don`t --

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: That was a crucial point in the debate right there.

Here`s a guy trying to talk about a plan that has bipartisan support
and Joe Biden stood up for the American people in the truth and wouldn`t
let him get away with it. That`s what made it a great debate.

I don`t care how many times someone is interrupted if the interruption
is in the service of the truth.

Democrats and progressives have had enough of the lies that the
Republicans have been throwing out in this campaign season. When Ryan
started lying about the Romney tax plan, Joe Biden was right to point out
just how the math does not add up.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RYAN: You can cut tax rates by 20 percent and still preserve these
important preferences for middle class taxpayers.

BIDEN: Not mathematically possible.

RYAN: It is mathematically possible. It`s been done before. It`s
precisely what we`re proposing.

BIDEN: It has never been done before.

RYAN: It`s been done a couple of times, actually.

BIDEN: It has never been done before.

RYAN: Jack Kennedy lowered taxes and increased growth. Ronald Reagan
--

BIDEN: Now you`re Jack Kennedy?

RYAN: Ronald Reagan.

Republicans and Democrats have worked together on this. I understand
you guys aren`t used to doing bipartisan deals.

BIDEN: We told each other what we were going to do. When we did it
with Reagan we said, here are the things we`re going to cut.

RYAN: We can agree with the framework, let`s work together to fill in
the details. That`s exactly --

BIDEN: Fill in the details.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Did you hear Paul Ryan just say, I understand that you guys
aren`t bipartisan? Does he follow the news? Does he follow his own party?
A record number of filibusters in the Senate?

Paul Ryan can`t fill in the details on this plan because there aren`t
any.

Ryan`s fatal flaw is really in his dishonesty. It showed, when Ryan
told personal stories about programs like Medicare and Social Security.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RYAN: Mom and I had my grandmother move in with us who was facing
Alzheimer`s. Medicare was there for her, just like it`s there for my mom
right now who`s a Florida senior. After my dad died, my mom and I got
Social Security survivors benefits. It helped me pay for college. It
helped her go back to college in her 50s where she started a small business
because of the new skills she got. She paid all of her taxes on the
promise that these programs would be there for her. We will honor this
promise and the best way to do it is reform it for my generation.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: That explanation right there is exactly why there`s no march
in the street. There`s no effort in this country to change the very
programs that we have for the elderly in this country. They are earned
benefits. They are not entitlement programs.

Of course, if Ryan really had these programs that really meant a lot
to him, he wouldn`t want to privatize everything and get his hands on it
like Social Security and turn Medicare into a voucher program. Joe Biden
was much more effective by directly addressing voters who rely on these
programs, the seniors.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BIDEN: It`s any senior out there, ask yourself, do you have more
benefits today? You do. If you`re near the doughnut hole, you have $600
more to help your prescription drug cost. You get wellness visits without
co-pays. They wipe all of this out and Medicare becomes insolvent in 2016.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Paul Ryan has lost touch with the working class roots of his
district and the working class that he says he came from. We think it was
privilege.

Biden still holds on to those roots in spades. The Ryan team knows
the candidate got schooled and they`re making excuses. Of course they are.
They say Paul Ryan wasn`t prepared for the vice president`s laughter.
Romney campaign spokesman Michael Steele told Chris Moody of Yahoo! News
the laughter certainly was not something that we expected.

Really? The Romney supporters on the "Wall Street Journal," the
editorial board, what do they do? Resorted to calling Joe Biden a bully?

Give me a break. So if you tell the American people the facts about
what`s going on with our government, hey, you`re nothing but a bully.

The right wingers don`t like it when they`re not allowed to lie all
day long without consequence. Now, this is what I really love. RNC
chairman Reince Priebus being the biggest cry baby of them all.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REINCE PRIEBUS, RNC CHAIRMAN: Quite frankly I was embarrassed for the
vice president. I mean, the laughs -- we counted 82 times that Joe Biden
interrupted Paul Ryan. I don`t know --

JIM ACOSTA, CNN: Paul Ryan was interrupting, too.

PRIEBUS: I don`t know who his debate partner was, I don`t know, maybe
it was Ed Schultz from MSNBC. I`m not sure.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Well, I can tell you, Mr. Chairman, I would be proud to be
the vice president`s debate partner after a performance like that because
he hit it out of the park. So I`ll just take credit for it. I know the
vice president watches this show.

He stood up for the middle class last night. He fought for the truth.
He showed a difference between a leader and a liar.

And as for the "Wall Street Journal" saying that the debate was a
disservice to voters, let me tell you what a disservice is to America. A
couple of candidates that go out there with Citizens United money and lie
to the American people about every policy, about every issue that`s out
there and shift in the wind whenever they possibly can to confuse a bunch
of people.

The truth is, lie after lie is not good for democracy, but they don`t
care. All they care about is political power. And as for being polite, I
will take the liberty to speak for the liberal community in this country
tonight. We are damn sick and tired of being run over by the top culture
in this country.

Being polite to the righties when they`re lying? No. That`s out of
bounds.

One more thing. Mr. President, I think Joe Biden gave you the
template for next week.

Get your cell phones out. I want to know what you think. Tonight`s
question: Who won the debate? Text "A" for Vice President Joe Biden. Text
"B" for Congressman Paul Ryan. To 622639. You can always go to our blog
and leave a comment at Ed.MSNBC.com. We got the results coming up later on
in the program.

Let`s bring in the vice president and executive director of MSNBC.com
and MSNBC political analyst, Richard Wolffe.

Richard, great to have you with us tonight.

RICHARD WOLFFE, MSNBC POLITICAL ANALYST: Thanks, Ed.

SCHULTZ: What does -- what does Biden`s performance really mean to
the entire race, to the base, to the tone, everything? What does it mean?

WOLFFE: Well, I think we saw a level set there last night where the
vice president not only did that fact checking, you know, obviously he was
combative and he laid out an argument there, but there was something bigger
going on. And I know we get into the blow by blow and the punch and the
counterpunch.

But really the only measure of these vice presidential candidates, no
matter what their track record and Vice President Biden has been very busy
inside the White House, but really the only measure for voters is can you
imagine them being a heartbeat away from the presidency? And everything
I`ve heard from conservative talk echo chamber today doesn`t deal with
that. They complain about the rules or about the interruptions or they say
he made a good argument. Not one of them say, even try to make the case,
that Paul Ryan is ready to be president the day after the election.

And that`s where vice president really won this thing. And if you
look at uncommitted voters, as opposed to Republicans, the base who are
already locked down, uncommitted voters yesterday looked to those two
candidates and said, one was a vice president.

SCHULTZ: You know, the tone of the campaign, there`s been so many
lies out there. Did Joe Biden have to do that last night? We showed a
couple of exchanges right there where he just jumped in. It was time after
time he was correcting Ryan. Do you think he had to do it?

WOLFFE: Well, I think you have to do it because the Romney campaign
is trying to completely rip up its script and start all over again with no
time to actually engage in the argument. And so, you have to do it right
there in the debate.

I don`t think people care about the interruptions at this point. They
know this is a feisty election. It`s hard fought. They`re used to
watching TV when frankly people don`t have Queensberry rules.

SCHUTLZ: Sure.

WOLFFE: The more important point about this, is that, you know, if
your best moment in the debate was about Benghazi and your opponent`s best
moment in the debate was about the economy, you really have the opponent
who got the better of you.

SCHULTZ: Richard, does this change anything for Tuesday night, debate
number two with the president and Mitt Romney?

WOLFFE: I think this is a pause. I think it stops the media
narrative which got way out of control. Frankly, it was way out of control
before the debate, as if the election was over. It was way out of control
after that first presidential debate saying it was over in the other
direction.

Here we`ve got a very close election. It was close before. It will
be close right up to Election Day. The vice president, I think, has
leveled the media narrative to a point where we can actually see the two
candidates going toe to toe next week.

SCHULTZ: All right. Richard Wolffe, thanks for your time tonight on
THE ED SHOW. Appreciate it.

WOLFFE: Thank you.

SCHULTZ: Remember to answer tonight`s question at the bottom of the
screen and share your thoughts on Twitter @EdShow and on Facebook. We
always want to know what you think.

Last night, Paul Ryan was confronted on the extreme anti-choice
position the Romney ticket presents. Terry O`Neill on the war on women,
next. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCHULTZ: Coming up, Republicans freak out over Vice President Joe
Biden`s big win. Karen Finney joins me on that.

Paul Ryan defends his tax plan but not very convincingly. David Cay
Johnston takes a crack at it.

And the war on women was alive and well last night with revealing
answers to a question about abortion. Terry O`Neill joins me next.

Share your thoughts with us on Facebook and on Twitter, using #EdShow.

We`re coming right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCHULTZ: Welcome back to THE ED SHOW. Thanks for watching tonight.

Mitt Romney continues to walk a tightrope over abortion rights. And
now, his running mate has reignited the war on women.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RADDATZ: If the Romney/Ryan ticket is elected, should those who
believe that abortion should remain legal be worried?

RYAN: We don`t think that unelected judges should make this decision
that people through their elected representatives in reaching a consensus
in society through the democratic process should make this determination.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: The translation, yes, you should be worried. Ryan wants to
legislate Roe v. Wade on a state level. And severely limit access to
abortion services.

Yet, just days ago, Mitt Romney told "The Des Moines Register"
newspaper that he would not push for any anti-choice measures.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

MITT ROMNEY (R), PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: There`s no legislation with
regards to abortion that I`m familiar with that would become part of my
agenda.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: And, of course, the Romney campaign quickly walked that
back, and allowed Ryan to articulate its new vision for women`s rights.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RYAN: The policy of a Romney administration will be to oppose
abortion with the exceptions for rape, incest, and life of the mother.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: But if creating policy was solely up to Paul Ryan, there
would be no exceptions. The legislation he co-sponsored proves it.

Vice President Biden called him out on it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BIDEN: My friend says that he -- well, I guess he accepts Governor
Romney`s position now because in the past he has argued that there was
rape, enforceable rape. He`s argued in the case of rape or incest, it
would be a crime to engage in having an abortion. I just fundamentally
disagree with my friend.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Joe Biden is no left wing ideologue when it comes to
abortion. Biden told the audience last night he believes in the Catholic
Church`s teachings that life begins at conception, yet Biden stressed he
does not believe in imposing his faith on others. His record, well, it
proves that.

The truth is, Mitt Romney has embraced an extreme anti-choice agenda.
If we are to believe all this stated positions on this issue, what`s he
going to do? Well, he`s going to defund Planned Parenthood. He`ll sign
legislation reversing Roe v. Wade and he`ll put extremists on the Supreme
Court who will overturn Roe v. Wade.

Now, is that what you want?

To that point, Vice President Biden reminded folks that the next
president will likely get the opportunity to potentially turn the tables on
women`s rights in this country.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BIDEN: The court, the next president will get one or two Supreme
Court nominees. That`s how close Roe v. Wade is. Just ask yourself, with
Robert Bork being the chief adviser on the court for -- for Mr. Romney, who
do you think he`s likely to appoint?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Isn`t the demeanor of the vice president very interesting
when he doesn`t have to debunk all the lies and he`s got a serious issue
like this?

Joining me now is the president of the National Organization for
Women, Terry O`Neill.

Terry, great to have you with us tonight. All I can say is after that
exchange is, wow. Did Paul Ryan reignite the war on women? Where are we
now?

TERRY O`NEILL, NATIONAL ORGANIZATION FOR WOMEN: Paul Ryan supports
personhood amendments. This is -- this is legislation that would decree
that life begins at conception, Ed.

And the truth is that if this goes into effect, that actually would
have the effect of criminalizing all abortion. Paul Ryan has said he
thinks there should be exceptions for forcible rape, but not exceptions for
women who are impregnated by rape.

Tens of thousands of women, by the way, are impregnated by rape every
year and Paul Ryan`s real belief is that he doesn`t think that they should
have access to abortion.

And the other thing is, I think we really need to remember, one in
three women will have an abortion by the age of 45. It is a common and
necessary aspect of women`s reproductive health. And what Paul Ryan wants
to do is make that reproductive health care unavailable to women. It`s
completely, very unpopular.

SCHULTZ: Now, just days ago, Paul Ryan said his position on abortion
and Romney`s were unified. Are they from what you can see?

O`NEILL: Actually I think day are and unified to be completely
opposed to women having access to a full range of reproductive health care.
Abortion, they don`t want women to have access to that. They also would
cut off women`s access to birth control without question.

Mitt Romney has repeatedly said he would defund Planned Parenthood.
Paul Ryan co-sponsored legislation and voted for legislation to do just
that and, in fact, to defund family planning clinics generally. That`s
contraception.

Paul Ryan has opposed the part of Obamacare that makes contraception
available to women without a co-pay. But we know that when women have
access to reliable birth control, they have better health outcomes
generally.

So, yes, I think Romney and Ryan are very much on the same page and
it`s very much opposed to women`s access to health care.

SCHULTZ: You think the vice president did an effective job talking
about the Obama administration`s records on women`s rights? I mean, do you
think the president said what the women in this country wanted to hear?

O`NEILL: I do, Ed. I think that I really so respect Joe Biden for
being very honest and sincere about his own personal beliefs and for
respecting and honoring the rights of women to have legal access to
necessary abortion care and birth control.

That said, may I just say that I really wish that women`s issues would
come up more in these debates. Frankly, Obama`s positions and Biden`s
positions are so good for women, especially when you compare them to how
bad the Romney/Ryan positions are. I would really love to see that coming
out more in the debates.

SCHULTZ: Well, we`ll see if the polls swing in the gender gap, again,
as they had tightened in recent weeks.

Terry O`Neill, thanks for joining us tonight here on THE ED SHOW.
Appreciate it.

Romney and Ryan have twisted themselves into knots over taxes and
showed up again last night big time. David Cay Johnston will join us to
tell us what it`s all about.

And Republicans, they didn`t like losing so they cried. Not fair!
Really?

Karen Finney and I will talk about it, next. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCHULTZ: Good to have you back with us. Thanks for watching THE ED
SHOW tonight. Now, it`s time to do some math.

Of course, Paul Ryan flunked the math test last night in front of
about 50 million people.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RADDATZ: And you`re -- and you`re going to increase the defense
budget.

RYAN: No, we`re not just going to cut the defense budget like they`re
-- they`re proposing --

BIDEN: They`re going to increase it $2 billion.

RYAN: That`s not --

(CROSSTALK)

RYAN: We`re talking about --

RADDATZ: So no massive defense increases?

RYAN: No, we`re saying don`t -- OK, you want to get into defense now?

RADDATZ: Yes, I do. I do, because that`s another math question.

RYAN: So -- right, OK.

RADDATZ: But I want to know how you do the math and have this
increase in defense spending?

BIDEN: Two trillion dollars.

RYAN: You don`t cut defense by a trillion dollars. That`s what we`re
talking about.

RADDATZ: And what -- what national security issues justify an
increase?

BIDEN: Who`s cutting it by $1 trillion?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Ryan simply can`t explain his 20 percent tax cut. Bottom --

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RADDATZ: You have refused -- and, again -- to offer specifics on how
you pay for that 20 percent across-the-board tax cut. Do you actually have
the specifics? Or are you still working on it, and that`s why you won`t
tell voters?

RYAN: Different than this administration, we actually want to have
big bipartisan agreements. You see, I understand the --

RADDATZ: Do you have the specifics? Do you have the --

(CROSSTALK)

BIDEN: That would -- that would be a first for the Republican
Congress.

RADDATZ: Do you know exactly what you`re doing?

RYAN: Look -- look at what Mitt Romney -- look at what Ronald Reagan
and Tip O`Neill did.

RADDATZ: No specifics, yes.

RYAN: What we`re saying, lower tax rates 20 percent. Start with the
wealthy, work with Congress to do it.

RADDATZ: You guarantee this math will add up?

RYAN: Absolutely. Six studies have guaranteed, six studies verified
this math adds up.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Ryan promises the numbers, they will add up, someday. My
math teacher would not have accepted that answer and I don`t think yours
would have, either. But when Ryan couldn`t come up with the numbers, he
started naming past presidents. And that didn`t go over very well, either.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RYAN: You can cut tax rates by 20 percent and still preserve these
important preferences for middle class taxpayers.

JOE BIDEN, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: It has never been
done before.

RYAN: It`s been tone a couple of times, actually.

BIDEN: It has never --

RYAN: Jack Kennedy lowered tax rates, increased growth.

BIDEN: Now you`re Jack Kennedy?

RYAN: Ronald Reagan --

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Let`s bring in David Cay Johnston to sort it out. Pulitzer
prize winning journalist and author of the book "the fine print: how big
companies use plain English to rob you blind."

David Cay, great to have you with us tonight.

Good to be here.

SCHULTZ: Isn`t Ryan supposed to -- you bet. Isn`t Ryan supposed to
be the brain of the Romney campaign and we`re lacking specifics? I mean,
wasn`t that a poor explanation?

DAVID CAY JOHNSTON, AUTHOR, THE FINE PRINT: Well, yes, and let me
give you his idea of a study. He said there are six studies. Three of
those six studies are blog posts and one of them is by a research assistant
at AEI, which is one of the big ideological marketing organizations that
pitch you their view of the world just the way companies advertise other
products. But blog posts, those are studies that prove things? That`s
hilarious.

SCHULTZ: Why doesn`t the plan add up? Why doesn`t his so-called plan
for America, the 20 percent cut, add up? Where`s the flaw?

JOHNSTON: Well, it does add up for the very rich. If you listen very
carefully to what Romney always says, he says he`s going to cut rates 20
percent and then he`s going to see to it that those at the top don`t pay a
larger share of the total tax burden. Well, that means that they`re going
to get a huge decrease in their tax bill. That`s the important element.
And that is the Ryan/Romney plan, it is to create dynastic wealth which I
think would be devastating to having our history of entrepreneurialism and
strivers in this country and allow people who are already rich to collect
income and interest dividends, capital gains, tax free or as Romney has put
it, not taxed on the first $200,000 to $250,000. Ryan`s plan is completely
tax free, get rid of the capital gains tax, get rid of the gift tax, create
dynastic wealth, turn America into 18th century France, and we all know how
well that ended.

SCHULTZ: David Cay, what about the loopholes? Middle class Americans
out there keep hearing that loopholes are going to be closed. What do you
think they`re talking about? They haven`t been specific on that, either.

JOHNSTON: No, and that`s part of the troubling idea. What they`re
very specific about is cutting taxes. They won`t talk about exactly what
are we going to do? And without knowing that, we have absolutely no idea.
Are they going to stop the use of offshore investing and total deferral of
income for private equity managers like Mitt Romney was when he was the
sole owner of Bain capital? And could have taken advantage of that? They
won`t say, so we have no idea. But the big numbers would be in taking away
the middle class` 401(k) or other retirement savings plans, health
insurance, and the mortgage interest deduction.

SCHULTZ: Yes. Let`s clear up this about Social Security. Play this
sound bite, if we can, real quick, fellows. This on Social Security in the
debate, it came up last night.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RADDATZ: Let`s talk about Medicare and entitlements. Both Medicare
and Social Security are going broke and taking a larger share of the budget
in the process. Will benefits for Americans under these programs have to
change for the programs to survive? Mr. Ryan?

RYAN: Absolutely. Medicare and Social Security are going bankrupt.
These are indisputable facts.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: David, what about that? Is Social Security going bankrupt?
I know the answer. I want to hear it from you.

JOHNSTON: Social security, last year, turned a $95 billion surplus.
It has a surplus built up, taxes we paid in advance for our benefits, of
well north of $2 trillion. The only reason Social Security`s future isn`t
strong is we haven`t had wage growth and haven`t had job growth. And Ryan
wants to get rid of Social Security. He is On the Record in so many places
saying that, that it is absurd of him to argue otherwise. And he clearly
wants to get rid of Medicare as we know it, replace it with a system that
only helps the rich.

SCHULTZ: All right. David Cay Johnston, great to have you with us on
this Friday evening on "the Ed Show." Thanks so much.

There`s a lot more coming up in the next half hour of "the Ed Show."
Stay with us.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Ever felt that way where you just want to deck
somebody?

SCHULTZ: Call the whambulance (ph). FOX News is freaking out about
Joe Biden.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It was openly contemptuous and disrespectful.

SCHULTZ: Tonight, Karen Finney, on whether it`s more disrespectful to
lie to America or to interrupt the guy who`s lying.

And Bain capital is sending American jobs overseas and Mitt Romney is
refusing to step in.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Our American dream got ripped out from underneath
us. And not because of any reason other than just pure greed.

SCHULTZ: Tonight, the massive protest in Freeport, Illinois, where
they are warning the country about Mitt Romney`s vision for America.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Before I even knew anything about Bain capital,
I actually kind of liked Mitt Romney.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCHULTZ: Welcome back to "the Ed Show." Breaking news out of
Colorado.

You`re looking at pictures of the exterior of the Obama campaign
Denver headquarters. Police are telling the "Denver Post" there were shots
fired at the window at the facility. There were people in the office when
the incident occurred. The incident occurred at 3:00 p.m. local time.
Police say that they have a description of a possible vehicle of interest.

According to a police spokesperson, it looks like it was one shot that
was fired into the structure. We will keep you posted as more information
comes to us here at "the Ed Show."

Again, the "Denver Post" reporting that shot was fired at the Obama
campaign headquarter in Denver, Colorado, at 3:00 this afternoon. No one
was injured in the shooting. And they do have a description of the car.
We`ll have more for you as it comes in.

Republicans are furious at vice president Joe Biden over his
performance in last night`s debate. It`s great news for Biden because it
is a clear sign he won the debate. Anchors over at FOX News were so angry
they compared vice president Biden to an obnoxious drunk?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MIKE HUCKABEE, FORMER ARKANSAS GOVERNOR: Joe Biden came across like a
guy that you meet at a cocktail party for some political event. An
obnoxious drunk who`s loud and boisterous and interrupts every
conversation.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I notice you guys were giving away bourbon to
people over there.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It`s the home of bourbon.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I wonder if Joe had some before the debate.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: FOX News expert debate analysis was on twitter. Three FOX
News hosts suggested that Biden had been drinking or compared him to a
drunk during the debate. To be clear, vice president Joe Biden does not
drink. Although in 2008, Biden did say quote "there are enough alcoholics
in my family." After the drunk talk was done came the excuses. Gretchen
Carlson had this one ready to go at 6:00 a.m. this morning.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GRETCHEN CARLSON, FOX NEWS CHANNEL ANCHOR: Being from the Midwest, as
Paul Ryan is as well, there`s such a thing as Midwestern sensibilities and
Midwestern politeness and, oh, yes, you go in front of me. You know,
that`s what Paul Ryan was doing.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Then the excuses turned to anger. A few minutes later this
happened.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CARLSON: You ever felt that way where you just want to deck somebody?
I mean, I`m sorry. I think if you`re Paul Ryan last night that`s how you
feel because you could tell that he didn`t want to come across as being
overly aggressive and knew he was going to be the young guy there and he
should show respect to the elder statesman. But my goodness.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: My goodness. I understand how you feel, Gretchen. That`s
how a lot of liberals felt about Dick Cheney. FOX News also noted how
disrespectful the vice president acted last night.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHRIS WALLACE, FOX NEWS CHANNEL ANCHOR: I don`t believe that I have
ever seen a debate in which one participant was as openly disrespectful of
the other as Biden was to Paul Ryan tonight.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: It was disrespectful for Paul Ryan to lie during the debate
last night. Joe Biden set the record straight by going after him. And FOX
News, they didn`t like one bit of it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Condescending, smug, morally and intellectually
bankrupt man.

CARLSON: Corruptness times 10 gazillion.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It`s technically called debatis interruptis (ph).

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mean at times.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Rude, condescending, disrespectful.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Rude, condescending, disrespectful. Now, we all know that`s
never happened on FOX News.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: And I don`t think we
should pretend otherwise.

BRETT BAIER, FOX NEWS CHANNEL ANCHOR: This --

OBAMA: Brett, let me finish my answer.

BAIER: Bu sir, I know you don`t like the filibuster.

OBAMA: Well, I`m trying to answer your questions and you keep on
interrupting.

BAIER: But, you want to change Washington, Mr. President. And now
we`re doing it the same way, right?

OBAMA: Look --

BAIER: Getting wrapped up and I don`t want to interrupt you.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Brett Baier interrupted the president of the United States
16 times during that interview. But he wasn`t disrespectful, was he? FOX
News shouldn`t be giving anyone a lecture in civility.

Joining me now is former DNC communications director and MSNBC
political analyst Karen Finney.

Karen, good to have you with us tonight.

KAREN FINNEY, MSNBC POLITICAL ANALYST: Hey, Ed.

SCHULTZ: Sum it up. How did Joe Biden do last night? Was he
disrespectful? Did he handle himself? Was it over the top?

FINNEY: You know what, Ed? Can I just say, what a bunch of wimps.
Last week when our guy didn`t do so good, we took our lumps. We said it
straight-out that the president didn`t do so well. Romney, you know, had a
good night. We just took it and we moved on.

And what are these guys doing? They`re like, he was mean to our guy.
How do they think Paul Ryan is going to do in front of Ahmadinejad or Putin
if he can`t handle sitting on the stage and having somebody call him on his
lies? I mean, that`s ridiculous.

SCHULTZ: Great point. Karen, what`s more disrespectful? Lying to
the American people or Biden, the vice president, interrupting Paul Ryan?

FINNEY: Well, and -- lying to the American people, but I can understand,
you know, remember, there`s this double standard. It`s very inconvenient
for these guys when someone is able to come to them with the facts and it`s
not something that FOX News ever does with these guys. They let them get
away with murder basically.

I mean, how many times did Biden say, I`ve got the letters? You`re
opposed to the stimulus, here are the letters when you asked for it. I was
there with Kennedy -- sorry, I was there with Reagan. They did have
details. You don`t have details. I mean, the problem Ryan had and this
is, again, I think your point at the top was right, that`s how you know he
won is that now they`re whining about the style and they can`t argue on the
substance.

SCHULTZ: Yes. He was smiling too much. You know, he just can`t
smile in these debates.

FINNEY: I mean, what is that?

SCHULTZ: Well, I think that Joe Biden was smiling just kind of
communicating with the liberal community in this country that, hey, the guy
next to me is really lying and I just want you to know I`m getting a big
kick out of it, I`m not going to get him get away with it.

FINNEY: Right.

SCHULTZ: You know, Republicans also attacked debate moderator Martha
Raddatz. Let`s take a look at this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SARAH PALIN (R), FORMER ICE PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: When the
moderator allowed one candidate to absolutely run roughshod over the
conversation.

BAIER: It was interesting that every time she seemed to interrupt
was, well, to bail out Joe Biden.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Don`t you think we need replacement refs at this point,
Karen? Don`t you think we just got to get some new people in there to do -
-

FINNEY: Oh, yes.

SCHULTZ: I mean, the thing I liked about it is that this is a
reporter, a professional reporter who is following up on her instincts and
the righty couldn`t take it. That`s how I see it. You your thoughts.

FINNEY: I completely agree. I mean, she started with a tough
question to the vice president about Benghazi, by the way. And you know
with Joe - I mean, here`s the thing about Joe Biden. He came prepared, had
his answers, knew his facts. This is the double standard we`ve seen from
Republicans. If Obama is ahead in the polls, you have you know, George
Will writing that, well, the only reason Americans want to fire him is
because he is black. If he`s up in the poll, then there`s a conspiracy
theory about the polls. If the job numbers are good there`s a conspiracy
theory about the jobs number despite the fact that all the data is there.

And then, they attack Stephanie Cutter for calling them out on, you
know, calling the Benghazi attacks political when Romney, himself, said he
would exploit that kind of opportunity. He said it, himself, in that same
47 percent video. It`s a double standard.

SCHULTZ: It is amazing what you can do when you have the facts on
your side.

Karen Finney, great to have you with us tonight. Thank you so much.

FINNEY: Thanks, Ed.

SCHULTZ: A real slap in the face to American workers is what it is,
and Mitt Romney, he won`t do a thing about it. It`s the Bain port story.
It`s big. It`s next. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCHULTZ: Up next, in the big finish, the jobs going overseas to
China, thanks to Mitt Romney. He won`t do anything about it. It`s a big
story. Leo Gerard joins me next.

Don`t forget, listen to my radio show on Sirius XM radio channel 127
Monday through Friday noon to 3:00 and on progressive talk stations around
the country. Follow me on twitter @edshow and like "the Ed Show" on
facebook. We are right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCHULTZ: Tonight in our survey I asked who won the debate. Ninety-
eight percent of you say vice president Joe Biden. Two percent of you say,
Congressman Paul Ryan. And I want to assure the American public tonight
watching "the Ed Show" this poll was not skewed in the least. We didn`t
cook the books.

Coming up, if he really wanted to show American pride, and if he
really cared about American middle class families, Mitt Romney would try to
save American jobs. But he won`t do it. The Sensata disgrace. Bainville
(ph), next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The thing for me, personally, that was even more
humiliating, though, was that the week before they came, they took the
American flag down that flew outside the plant and the week after they
left, they put it back up. Like we`re supposed to be ashamed that we`re
Americans.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Welcome back to "the Ed Show."

I want America to consume this story. This is who Mitt Romney is.
Those were workers from Sensata technologies, a car sensor manufacturing
company in Freeport, Illinois, describing the painful process of losing
their jobs to Chinese workers.

The company, majority owned by Bain capital, is set to close its
doors, lay off its U.S. workers and outsource production to China by the
end of this year. In protests, workers have set up a camp called Bain port
just across the street from the plant many devoted their lives to. Three
protesters were arrested Monday for attempting to block trucks removing
equipment from the plant to ship them to China.

Now, the Romney camp said the governor has had been no longer
responsible for Bain decisions but doesn`t mean he`s not going to be
profiting from Bain`s cost cutting through outsourcing. "The New York
Times" reports that Romney owns about $8 million worth of Bain funds that
hold 51 percent of Sensata shares. If Sensata saves money by closing the
Freeport plant, that of course, could add money to Mr. Romney`s trust
accounts now or after the election.

So, folks, what`s going on in Freeport, Illinois, gives us, I believe,
a snapshot of what Mitt Romney`s economy will look like. This is the model
he created. This is the model that he believes in. This is his America.
And this is the model that made him wealthy. Good for him, bad for the
workers.

Romney can try to distance himself all he wants. He can talk tough on
the road about China and out on the campaign trail, but talk is cheap. And
his refusal to act, his refusal to even listen to these Sensata workers
shows his complete and I mean utter disregard for the families being
affected by this move.

Make no mistake, this is not just about Freeport, Illinois. This is
about the future of American jobs and if Mitt Romney is elected president
of the United States, put your seat belt on, there will be more of this.

Let`s bring in the president of the united steelworkers, Leo Gerard.
And I want to point right off the top tonight that this is a nonunion plant
in Freeport, Illinois.

Mr. Gerard, what do you make of this story? First of all, taking down
the American flag, forcing workers to train their Chinese replacements who
make only 99 cents an hour. Is this just the perfect story of the race to
the bottom line and what it looks like in America?

LEO GERARD, PRESIDENT, UNITED STEEL WORKERS: I think two things, Ed.
I think, first, it`s exactly the way you characterize it. This is the real
Mitt Romney who doesn`t give a good darn about workers and this is really a
disgrace to the country to let this happen.

He has $8 million invested in this, but Ed, he`s also got ten other
Chinese investments. And you remember we did a story not very long ago
about another company that had Bain investments from `98 to 2000 which was
Mitt Romney`s personal money.

In this case, these workers, I want to correct two things that you
said. First of all, they`re scheduling the closure of the plant, to add
insult to injury, they`re closing the plant on November the 5th, one day
before the election. They thought they could get away with this and it
wouldn`t spill over on Mitt Romney. These workers reached out to us and
we`re telling their story all over America.

Secondly, that the workers in China make 90 cents an hour working 12
hours a day, seven days a week, and they`re staying in the company`s
bunkhouses. Three and four young women to a room. Inadequate food,
inadequate housing. And this is how he`s going to make his money.

This is a disgrace. This tells you who real Mitt Romney is. This
tells you why he won`t disclose his taxes. This company is now
headquartered in Bermuda and I`m convinced that his IRA money will either
go to the Cayman Islands or one of his Swiss bank accounts. This is why he
won`t disclose his tax returns because he has ten other of these funds in
China.

The other thing I want to make sure we say is that in the earlier case
between 1998 and 2000, that`s when Mitt Romney`s personal money was in
China before we did the trade deal with China to let them into the WTO.
And once he learned how to do this stuff in China, he then turned his
company into a consulting firm that taught other companies how to move to
China. This is a disgrace. He ought to lose the election just on this
issue.

SCHULTZ: Mr. Gerard, what about the fund-raising tape behind closed
doors that was revealed by "Mother Jones," the infamous 47 percent comment?
Mitt Romney was talking about jobs in China and a factory over there. Is
there any connection here in this story?

GERARD: This is a second story. The story that you did a few weeks
ago about the other plant, that was the story of the plant that he went to
see in between 1998 and 2000 where he told the story of young women working
in sweatshop conditions, and food wasn`t good. They had barbed wire to
keep them out. In that case there was 12 to a dorm sleeping in bunk beds
that only had plywood on them. That was Mitt Romney`s first foray into
China.

And on that secret tape, that`s the plant he`s talking about that he
went over there to buy. And then in addition to that, Ed, when he talks
about he`s not responsible for the 47 percent, he is going to try to make
more people fall into that category because he has no respect for them.
These are hardworking families. These are families who have been there.
There`s one family that I met that put their kids through college with that
one. The other family that both the husband and wife worked there.
They`re not going to be able to send their kids to dance lessons for God`s
sake. And this is Mitt Romney`s way of making money.

SCHULTZ: And no doubt about it.

GERARD: America has to see this. This can`t be the America we are
heading to. We got to see this.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY
BE UPDATED.
END

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