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updated 9/27/2012 11:21:38 AM ET 2012-09-27T15:21:38

THE ED SHOW with ED SCHULTZ
September 26, 2012

Guests: Chris Redfern, Jim McDermott, Ayanna Pressley, Chris Kofinis, Richard Carmona


ED SCHULTZ, HOST: Good evening, Americans. And welcome to THE ED
SHOW, from New York.

Forty-one days until the 2012 election and only seven days until the
first presidential debate.

Mitt Romney is telling NBC News the race is tied. Really? Well,
tonight we`ll reintroduce the Romney campaign to the concept of arithmetic.

This is THE ED SHOW -- let`s get to work.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MITT ROMNEY (R), PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: President Obama and I both
care about poor and middle class families. The difference is, my policies
will make things better for them.

SCHULTZ (voice-over): Mitt Romney is still trying to clean up his 47
percent problem and America isn`t buying it.

Tonight, E.J. Dionne on today`s disastrous new poll numbers for
Republicans.

An Ohio Democratic Party chair, Chris Redfern, on Mitt Romney`s
failure to dot the "I" in the Buckeye State.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It`s not consistent with our polling, Steve.

SCHULTZ: The Romney campaign has officially joined the poll truthers.
Tonight, we will debunk the Republican alternate reality.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There is a fundamental error going on in the
polling this year by the media organizations.

SCHULTZ: And there`s more fallout from Senator Scott Brown`s race-
baiting campaign.

We`ll have the latest from Boston.

And the star of TV`s "Dirty Jobs" gets his dirtiest job yet.

ROMNEY: Mike Rowe, as you know, well, he`s a guy who has made a name
for himself by doing things other people don`t want to do. Really ugly,
dirty jobs. Like standing with a politician.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SCHULTZ: I`ll explain why Mike Rowe was standing on the wrong stage
with the wrong candidate today.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SCHULTZ: Good to have you with us tonight, folks. Thanks for
watching.

No Republican candidate has ever lost Ohio and won the presidency.
Mitt Romney is on the verge of becoming yet another victim of this
statistic.

Ohio`s 18 electoral votes are vital to Romney`s chances of winning in
November. If Mitt Romney loses Ohio, he`s going to have to win all six
swing states where the president currently leads.

The president`s lead in Ohio is starting to look dominant. In a FOX
News poll, President Obama leads by seven points. A "Washington Post" poll
puts the president up by eight points in Ohio. And the most recent poll by
CBS and "The New York Times" has President Obama leading by 10 points.

Romney was in Ohio today, making a new pitch to voters. He`s the guy
who understands their pain.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ROMNEY: There are so many in our country that are hurting right now.
I want to help them. I know what it takes to get an economy going again
and creating jobs.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Voters in Ohio don`t believe Romney on this front at all.
When it comes to the economy, 51 percent of Ohio voters say they trust
President Obama against 45 percent of voters who trust Mitt Romney. Obama
has an advantage on the economy in Ohio, because basically, this state is a
national success story when it comes to the economy.

Listen to Mitt Romney`s Ohio surrogate, Governor John Kasich. It
doesn`t sound like there`s much reason for Ohio voters to make a change.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. JOHN KASICH (R), OHIO: You know, I hope you all know that Ohio`s
coming back from 48th in job creation to number four, number one in the
Midwest. From 89 cents and a rainy day fund to a half a billion dollars,
and we have grown 123,000 jobs in the state of Ohio. Our families are
going back to work.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Governor Kasich, you forgot to tell us where you stood on
that automobile thing that was kind of big in your state, one in eight jobs
are connected to the automobile industry, which, of course, President Obama
helped out with the automobile loan, which all you Republicans can`t stand.

Things are great, so vote for Mitt Romney, right? I don`t think so.

Today, Romney launched a new ad campaign. According to the
"Washington Post`s" Greg Sargent, this new 60-second television ad -- well,
it`s going to replace all English-language Romney ads in nine states. It`s
another attempt to soften Romney`s image.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ROMNEY: President Obama and I both care about poor and middle class
families. The difference is, my policies will make things better for them.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: He`s sticking up for President Obama. That`s kind of cool,
isn`t it?

Romney hopes this video will have an impact. But there`s another
video affecting Romney`s campaign in a very much bigger way.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ROMNEY: And so my job is not to worry about those people. I`ll never
convince them they should take personal responsibility and care for their
lives.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: It is brutal. The hidden fund-raiser video where Romney
disparaged 47 percent of Americans is not helping with swing voters.

It`s also hurting Romney with his base. "The New York Times" talked
to a worker, Kenneth Myers (ph), an unemployed Republican from Ohio.
Romney`s comments didn`t sit well with Myers.

"The last thing, where he was going on about the 47 percent who are
dependent on the government, is hard to swallow. I think I`m part of the
47 percent he`s talking about. But I don`t want to be dependent on the
government." That`s a pretty good indication of where that comment has
taken this campaign.

The Obama campaign is hammering Romney`s comments in television ads in
Ohio. It appears to be taking a toll on Romney`s number. The Gallup
tracking poll showed Romney making up ground with President Obama after the
Democratic National Convention. A week after the fund-raising video was
released by "Mother Jones", Obama has opened up a six-point lead.

President Obama was also in Ohio today, delivering a knockout punch.
And, oh, yes, he reminded Ohio voters where Mitt Romney was when the state
needed him at a critical time.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: When my opponent said
we should just let Detroit go bankrupt, that would have meant walking away
from an industry that supports one in eight Ohio jobs. It supports
businesses in 82 of 88 Ohio counties.

So when he said that, I said, no, I`m going to bet on America. I`m
betting on American workers.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Ohio`s 7.2 percent unemployment rate is directly linked to
the auto rescue, the loan. Romney`s campaign will live to regret "Let
Detroit go bankrupt," that editorial, that of course he penned in a Detroit
newspaper.

According to CNN, a longtime GOP strategist called Obama`s advantage
on the automobile loan a kick in the blanks for the Romney campaign. You
can fill in the blanks for yourself. I think you know what he said.

Romney is also still struggling to undo the damage done by ads
highlighting his record at Bain Capital. The Obama campaign and super PACs
flooded the airwaves in Ohio with ads, pushing Romney`s anti-working man
image. One particular ad was especially damaging.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MIKE EARNEST: Out of the blue one day, we were told to build a 30-
foot stage, gathered the guy, and we built that 30-foot stage, not knowing
what it was for. Just days later, all three shifts were told to assemble
in the warehouse. A group of people walked out on that stage and told us
that the plant is now closed and all of you are fired. Mitt Romney made
over $100 million by shutting down our plant and devastated our lives. It
turns out that when we built that stage, it was like building my own
coffin.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: That ad was put on the Internet by Priorities USA super PAC
supporting the president. The ad was viewed millions of times and 60
percent of the views came from the state of Ohio.

Romney needs to turn things around in Ohio, and he needs to do it in a
hurry. He`s running out of time, and the buck to trend in the Buckeye
State. Well, it`s going to be awfully tough to do.

He has never really connected with the middle class. I`ve said it
like a broken record on this program time and time again.

And later in this broadcast, we`ll show you how Romney is trying to
connect to the middle class with this guy who does TV ads for some car
outfit, and wears the hat and has his own show. And he`s standing on the
wrong stage. We`ll get to that later.

Get your cell phones out. I want to know what you think.

Tonight`s question: who`s going to win Ohio? Text "A" for the
president and text "B" for Mitt Romney to 622639. You can always go to our
blog at Ed.MSNBC.com. We`ll bring you the results later on in the show.

Joining me tonight is E.J. Dionne of "The Washington Post," also an
MSNBC contributor, and author of "Our Divided Political Heart," and Chris
Redfern, chairman of the Ohio joins us tonight.

Gentlemen, great to have you with us.

E.J., you first. This is quite a mountain to climb for any campaign,
whether it`s Mitt Romney or anybody else. How is he going to be able to do
it?

E.J. DIONNE, WASHINGTON POST: Well, I think he knows he`s in a hole,
because that ad you showed where he said, both of us care about poor and
middle class families, that was an almost an entirely defensive ad. And
that Quinnipiac/"New York Times"/CBS poll showed why. There was a question
in there that asked voters: does Obama, does Romney care about the rich,
the middle class, the poor, or everyone equally?

Now, most polls the that give four choices usually get scattered
answers -- 58 percent of the people in Ohio said that Mitt Romney`s
policies favored the rich. By contrast, 59 percent said that Obama`s
policies favored either everybody equally or the middle class. That`s a
17-point gap.

And I think the auto rescue is part of it. Those Bain ads are part of
it. Ken Blackwell, the former Republican secretary of state was on CNN
today, and he said it was just like `04. Bush roughed up Kerry in the
summer and Kerry never recovered.

And he didn`t say Romney will never recover, but the implication was,
Romney`s in a heap of trouble.

SCHULTZ: Chris Redfern, who was the chairman of the Democratic Party
in Ohio also with us tonight.

Chris, A very untenable position that Governor Kasich is being placed
in, to go out and talk about the economy when it`s all positive for
workers, and Mitt Romney`s had nothing to do about it. What do you make of
that?

CHRIS REDFERN, OHIO DEMOCRATIC PARTY: Well, it`s really important to
realize that the downturn in the unemployment rates in Ohio began long
before John Kasich took office. A close look at the record, we will
reflect that the auto rescue occurred long before John Kasich had a chance
to take his turn as governor. And the commitment that the president made
to middle income earners in places like Toledo, a location that Mitt Romney
stopped today and didn`t even mention Jeep --

SCHULTZ: So you`re on a roll. The Democrats in Ohio are on a roll.
How do you keep from being overconfident right now? It`s almost like
you`re running up the score.

REDFERN: Well, we`re going to try to get every vote out. There`s
11.5 million Ohioans and every vote is going to count. But the old adage,
only poll that matters is election night, actually, it`s not true. It`s a
week from night when early vote begins in earnest in the state of Ohio.

And we`re going to drive 2.5 million Democrats and independents to the
polls and ensure that those votes are counted earlier and that we`re well
positioned in the remaining weeks of this campaign to win for the president
and for the Senator Brown, his close ally in the United States Senate.

SCHULTZ: E.J., we just got a piece of an videotape in, an interview
with Mitt Romney that he did with NBC`s Ron Allen. I want to play it for
you and get your reaction afterwards. Here it is.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RON ALLEN, NBC NEWS: One thing you seem to have trouble convincing
people of is that you are the person that cares about middle class people,
people who are struggling. They don`t see in your background and your
comments the kind of empathy, sympathy and understanding that could really
solve their problems.

ROMNEY: I think people had the chance who watched our Republican
convention to see the lives I`ve had a chance to touch during my life, to
understand that I served as a pastor of a congregation with people of all
different backgrounds and economic circumstances, that I care very deeply
about the American people and people of different socioeconomic
circumstances.

And I think throughout this campaign as well, we`ve talked about my
record in Massachusetts. Don`t forget, I got everybody in my state
insured, 100 percent of the kids in our state have health insurance. I
don`t think there`s anything that shows more empathy.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: "Shows more empathy"? E.J., Romney has gotten himself in
the past of talking up his signature piece of health care legislation, but
then he`s gone out and said one of the first things he`s going to do is
repeal Obamacare. I mean, the guy continues the stumble over himself.
Your take on it?

DIONNE: You listen to that, and the obvious question is, well, if
it`s such a good idea, Obama adopted your plan nationally, and imagine what
Rush Limbaugh is going to say tomorrow about Romney defending his
Massachusetts plan. Maybe he`s trying to break out of his box. But he`s
in a terrible position on this.

But I think the one way that Romney could carry Ohio is if he gets the
replacement refs to count the votes. And maybe we`ll have a different
result.

SCHULTZ: Exactly. How can he care about people, care about workers
when he has them build the stage, when they announce that they`re taking
over the company, and oh, by the way, all your jobs are going overseas. I
mean, that to me is a pretty tough sale. The middle class has been really
his downfall throughout this whole campaign.

Chris, a big key in Ohio will be early voting. What`s the impact it`s
going to have on the race?

REDFERN: Well, four or five years ago when early vote began, we saw
that we have a better turnout operation than our Republican friends. We`ve
got operation all across the state, and we have cultivated relationships
with the voters over the course of the last couple of years. But it`s
really important to realize.

SCHULTZ: You`ve got to know where the voting machines are going to
be, too.

REDFERN: We know where the voters are and the voting machines are.
And we also know four words that Mitt Romney uttered that allowed us to
push people to the polls. Let Detroit go bankrupt.

Eight hundred fifty thousand Ohio jobs, we know what those are,
they`re right here in the Buckeye State because Barack Obama stood up for
those jobs. We know where the voting booths are, in places like Toledo at
the YMCA on Jefferson Street, where it`s easy and great access to get to
and we`re going to turn out the vote.

SCHULTZ: All right. E.J. Dionne and Chris Redfern, great to have
both of you with us tonight here on THE ED SHOW.

Remember to answer tonight`s question there at the bottom of the
screen, share your thoughts on Twitter @EdShow and on Facebook. We would
really like to get your comments on Ohio. It`s such a crucial state.

Coming up, it was not an endorsement, but Mike Rowe of "Dirty Jobs"
joined Mitt Romney today in Ohio. We`ll tell you why he might not want to
give the candidate, you know, too much love. In fact, he ought to take a
second look, a very close look. Congressman Jim McDermott joins me for
the discussion.

Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCHULTZ: Coming up, "Dirty Jobs" host Mike Rowe joins Mitt Romney on
the campaign trail to discuss jobs and vocational training. I think he`s
campaigning with the wrong guy.

Scott Brown`s race-baiting comments about Elizabeth Warren and his
supporter`s racist chances have the Cherokee nation asking the senator for
an apology.

And could Democrats turn Arizona blue this November? Romney`s lead in
the poll is shrinking and the Senate race is heating up. Democratic Senate
candidate Richard Carmona will join me.

Please share your thoughts with us on Facebook and on Twitter using
#EdShow.

We`re right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCHULTZ: Welcome back to THE ED SHOW. Thanks for watching tonight.

Mitt Romney held a manufacturing roundtable in Bedford Heights, Ohio,
today and he welcomed to the stage someone who was well known to many
Americans.

Mike Rowe of "Dirty Jobs" on the Discovery Channel. You may also know
him from those Ford television commercials. Today, he shared the stage
with Romney without actually endorsing him.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ROMNEY: He is nonpartisan. He`s not here to endorse me. He`s not
here to add support to one campaign or another. He`s here to talk about
his ideas.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Sure. Mr. Rowe did offer some ideas, and he talked about
the kinds of people he cares about.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MIKE ROWE, HOST, "DIRTY JOBS": The people who keep the lights on, the
people who allow the toilets to work, the people who pick up roadkill, the
people who paint the bridges, the people who farm, the people who mine.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: It`s safe to say there is a candidate for president who
cares about those very same people. But it`s not the candidate Rowe was
sharing the stage with today. Rowe talked about putting these people back
to work and so has the president of the United States.

When President Obama tried to sell his jobs bill last year over the
refusal of the Republican Congress, he talked about the kinds of people who
would get those kinds of jobs.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: It`s a bill that would
put people back to work, rebuilding America, repairing our roads, repairing
our bridges, repairing our schools. It would lead to jobs for concrete
workers like the ones here at Hilltop, jobs for construction workers and
masons, carpenters, plumbers, electricians, architects, engineers,
ironworkers. Put folks back to work.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Mike Rowe said part of the problem was training.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ROWE: Jobs depend on opportunity and training. Over and over, that`s
what I hear, we need more opportunity and we need better training.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Once again, there is a candidate who believes in job
training, who understands we need more vocational training.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OBAMA: One of the, I believe, mistakes we`ve made 20, 30 years ago
was to start de-emphasizes vocational education. Right now, we`ve got
shortages of folks in fields that need technical training, but don`t
necessarily require a four-year college degree.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Mr. Rowe went on to make a more subtle point about how we
need as a country to appreciate these kinds of wage earners.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ROWE: Opportunity and training aren`t enough. You need desire. I`m
talking about desire in the sense of appreciation, with the rest of us.
People with dirty jobs, skilled tradesmen, they represent a fairly modest
part of the population.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Oh, we know how many Mitt Romney views many of the wage
earners in this country, because we know what he said about the 47 percent
of American who is pay no federal income taxes.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ROMNEY: Forty-seven percent of Americans pay no income taxes. And so
my job is not to worry about those people. I`ll never convince them that
they should take personal responsibility and care for their lives.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: I would just say to Mr. Rowe, I`m glad that you are
nonpartisan, but I really believe that the other candidate is the one that
you should be sharing the stage with, not Mitt Romney.

Joining me tonight, Congressman Jim McDermott of Washington.

Congressman, great to have you with us tonight.

Just for the record, you know, I think Mr. Rowe must be a pretty good
guy, very successful in the television industry, a good communicator. But
isn`t this a perfect example of how folks who are wage earners may not be
paying attention to who actually is fighting for them and might even step
up on the wrong stage and vote for the wrong person? Your thoughts.

REP. JIM MCDERMOTT (D), WASHINGTON: Well, this is a desperate attempt
by Romney to put a whole different spin on his campaign, to suddenly
becomes someone who cares about people who do the dirty work in this
society. He has shown no sympathy for them in the past, he has shown no
sympathy for their health care needs or their education needs or their
employment needs.

I mean, the auto industry is a perfect example. But there are lots of
others. And they are now realizing with their numbers falling through the
floor that they`ve got to do something to look like they care about working
America. It is really a desperate move.

SCHULTZ: And the Democrats have been very specific in their efforts.
It was President Obama who was trying time and time again to come forward
with a specific jobs bill for infrastructure -- that would affect the kind
of jobs that they`re talking about on the Romney stage today. And I guess
we have to remind Americans of the kind of obstruction that was in the
environment in Washington.

MCDERMOTT: We went again and again and again to the floor to try and
get infrastructure funding. And the Republicans simply held it up.

I mean, Paul Ryan was right in the center of it. And now you`re going
to make him vice president of the United States, in charge of opposing
infrastructure building. It makes no sense.

The country cannot work if we don`t invest both in people`s education
and in the infrastructure, and Romney has no record of it, and Paul Ryan
has a record of being against it.

SCHULTZ: Yes.

MCDERMOTT: So I don`t see how anybody`s going to vote for them.

SCHULTZ: I mean, on the stage, the theatrics of it all and the
semantics of it as well -- Mike Rowe is up there talking about the very
people that Mitt Romney was dissing behind closed doors at that fund-
raiser.

He can`t say it about them, but maybe this guy can. Maybe I`ll hand
the microphone to this guy, this guy named Mike Rowe, who wears a workman`s
hat and a sweatshirt and goes around and has pretty good visibility, maybe
he can get up there and say that I really do care about these folks. I
mean, I find this of somewhat of a desperate move, the choreography of all
of this.

MCDERMOTT: Well, it`s really based, Ed, on the idea that the American
people are stupid and they`ll forget what he said last week. And now he
comes with this show today and says, no, that wasn`t me last week. That --
you forget about that guy. I`m a guy who really cares about working
people.

The American voters are not -- they did not miss the point about the
47 percent who don`t pay income tax. The unemployed don`t pay -- they
don`t pay income tax. And those people are the ones we`re talking about
here.

SCHULTZ: Congressman Jim McDermott, great to have you on "HE ED SHOW
-- thanks so much. Keep up the fight, my friend.

Coming up, new video and new trouble for Republican Senator Scott
Brown. Find out what this tape can tell us about the senator and his
offensive tactics on the campaign trail.

And Republicans don`t like reality, so they have created, I guess you
could say, a very new reality with a wild conspiracy theory, numerous ones,
I might add, about the polls showing that President Obama is in the lead.
Chris Kofinis joins me next.

Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCHULTZ: And we are back.

We wish we could report Republican Senator Scott Brown is apologizing
for the offensive race baiting during a rally on Saturday. Several of
Brown`s staffers have been identified in this video yelling war chants and
doing the tomahawk chop.

They`re targeting Brown`s opponent, Elizabeth Warren. Brown claims
she lied about her Native American heritage, but Senator Brown will not
apologize for the racist rally. And this morning, the principal chief of
the Cherokee Nation issued a statement, demanding answers. "I call upon
Senator Brown to apologize for the offensive actions of his staff and their
uneducated, unenlightened and racist portrayal of native peoples." Just
before 7:00 p.m. tonight, Brown`s spokesperson released this statement,
"Senator Brown has spoken to his entire staff, including the individuals
involved in the unacceptable behavior, and issued them their one and only
warning that this type of conduct will not be tolerated. He regrets that
members of his staff did not live up to the high standards that the people
of Massachusetts expect and deserve."

My friends, may I point out, this is not exactly an apology. In fact,
the state Democratic party is circulating a new video which shows the
racist chanting could be a normal part of the Brown campaign.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: When professor warren makes a mistake, claiming that she`s a
Native American --

(LAUGHTER)

BROWN: You know, she could have very easily just said, you know what,
I`m sorry, I made a mistake, it`s something my family told me.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Here are the facts. Scott Brown is the Republican
sweetheart in the most expensive Senate race in the country. He`s a
sitting United States senator. And he is attacking his opponent on her
ethnic background. The date, 2012.

Can you believe it? Let`s turn to Boston City Council Member Ayanna
Pressley. Ms. Pressley, great to have you with us tonight. I appreciate
your time. How damaging is this to Senator Brown`s campaign?

AYANNA PRESSLEY, BOSTON CITY COUNCILOR: It needs to be very damaging.
This, actually -- I don`t consider this to be race baiting. There`s
nothing coy, codified or couched about this. It`s just outright racist.
But it is consistent with Scott Brown. He has been running scared. This
is a tactic.

Elizabeth Warren has consistently campaigned on the facts. And Scott
Brown has consistently personally attacked. And now his staff -- and it`s
important to underscore that these are not just overzealous supporters.
These are people who taxpayers pay their salary, who are on his payroll,
who are supposed to be advising him on policy, advocating for constituents.

All eyes are on Massachusetts with this Senate race. And this is a
very sad commentary. We know that Scott --

SCHULTZ: What do you make of Senator Brown`s statement to his staff?
Do you consider that an apology? Does it go far enough? And what about
the reaction of the Cherokee chief?

PRESSLEY: The reaction from the chief is appropriate, and certainly
not surprising. Scott Brown has not gone far enough. You know, if
affiliation and association were irrelevant, Scott Brown wouldn`t continue
to distance himself from Mitt Romney. I am a former -- before I was
elected to office, I was an aide to a United States senator. And it is
fair to say that your staff is not only a reflection of you, but a
reflection on you.

SCHULTZ: When he said, in the debate, that you could look at
Elizabeth Warren and tell that she was not Native American, I mean, I about
fell over when I saw that. I mean, that plays right into the Arizona Show
Me Your Papers law, the big controversy we`ve had about that. What was
your response to that?

PRESSLEY: Well, my response right now is that I don`t have to be -- I
am a black woman, but I`m not only offended by these remarks, as a black
woman, I don`t have to be Native American to be offended. I`m offended as
an American. Scott Brown isn`t just a candidate. He is a sitting United
States senator. And I want someone in that seat who subscribes to e
pluribus Unum, out of many, we are one. This is a completely in
contradiction to that.

SCHULTZ: What is the conversation in Boston about this? Is this the
hot topic? Is this going to put Scott Brown in further trouble in the
polls?

PRESSLEY: Well, it`s incredibly exposing, but again it`s a consistent
tactic. I think he has demonstrated in his voting record that he has sided
with big oil and billionaires. And now I fear he`s exposed that he`ll side
with bigots as well.

SCHULTZ: Ayanna Pressley, city council woman in Boston, great to have
you with us tonight. Thanks so much.

There`s a lot more coming up in the next half hour of THE ED SHOW.
Stay with us.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DICK MORRIS, FOX NEWS CONTRIBUTOR: On Friday, I looked at the real
poll numbers by an organization that I can`t name, but I trust it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: The Romney campaign joins the growing number of Republican
poll Truthers.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And in every single one of them, they have a
Democratic voter participation that is higher than the participation in the
electorate in 2008.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Up next, we will explain why their alternate reality is a
fantasy land.

And all of a sudden Arizona is back in play for Senate Democrats. The
Republican lead in deep red Arizona is shrinking. Democratic candidate
Richard Carmona joins me tonight for an exclusive interview.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MORRIS: Today we`ll talk about the real poll numbers. The media is
circulating this myth that Romney is in serious trouble. Well, on Friday I
looked at the real poll numbers by an organization that I can`t name, but I
trust it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Welcome back to THE ED SHOW. That was Dick Morris, that`s
right, talking about his super secret polling source more than a month ago.
And it seems Republicans are now working harder than ever to create their
own reality. The conspiracy theories have reached Fox News.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, if you look at the mainstream media, the big
headline is, according to their polling, Mitt Romney is, what, five, six,
seven, eight points behind Barack Obama right now. Is that the same kind
of polling you guys are finding with your internal?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Hold it right there. Doocy (ph) is complaining about all
those mainstream media polls? But Fox News` most recent poll had President
Obama up by five points over Mitt Romney. Here`s Ed Gillespie of the
Romney campaign answering his question.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ED GILLESPIE, ROMNEY CAMPAIGN MANAGER: It is not consistent with our
polling, Stephen. I`m struck by a couple of things. One, there are three
swing state polls out today. And in every single one of them, they have a
Democratic voter participation that is higher than the participation in the
electorate in 2008.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Gillespie is complaining about something a lot of
Republicans have been complaining about as of late. They say Democrats are
being over sampled in all of these polls. By the way, the same Fox News
poll showed 42 percent identifying as Democrats and 36 identifying as
Republicans.

This Republican talking point has gotten new life because of a website
claiming to fix all these inaccurate polls that are out there. It changes
every national poll to fit the party breakdown used by Scott Rasmussen of
Rasmussen Reports. But Scott Rasmussen said, "you cannot compare partisan
weighting from one polling firm to another. Different firms ask about
partisan affiliation in different ways."

So even the hero pollster of the right debunks the idea that all these
national polls should be retooled to fit his methods.

Let`s bring in Democratic strategist Chris Kofinis tonight. Chris,
great to have you with us. I think we`ve seen it all now. This is a heck
of a sale job going on. The right wing is going full tilt on this,
claiming all of these polls are over sampling Democrats. Have at it.

CHRIS KOFINIS, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: Even if, for example, you cede
the argument that occasionally you`re going to have polls that are off,
because that`s the nature of polling. You`re never going to have
consistency across every poll. And even if you give the argument and say,
you`re right, there are some methodological differences in the models that
different polls use to determine likely voters, tell me the poll where
Governor Romney`s ahead.

I mean, show me the poll where he`s ahead in Florida. Show me the
poll where he`s ahead in Ohio. He`s behind in almost every single
battleground state, except potentially North Carolina. And there are polls
showing him behind there.

Part of the problem here is you can scream about public polling and
how inaccurate it is. The reality is, no one believes, not even I think
Governor Romney`s campaign, believes they`re ahead in any of these critical
states.

SCHULTZ: Here`s Rush Limbaugh and Steve Doocy on the conspiracy
theory. Here it is.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RUSH LIMBAUGH, RADIO TALK SHOW HOST: They want you thinking your
side`s lost. They want you thinking it`s over for what you believe. And
that makes you stay home and don`t vote.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They`re going to show Mr. Obama way up in the
polls just to tamp down enthusiasm, so republicans go, why even bother
voting.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: It`s that liberal media. We`re going to be out there
suppressing the Republican vote. Does the Obama campaign need to even
respond to this garbage?

KOFINIS: I don`t think they need to respond, but what I would say, as
Democrats, I think we need to be very careful about being overconfident.
This race is not like 2008. And that`s one thing that still gives me a
little bit of pause and concern. 2008, you knew it was over by mid-
September, as soon as the financial crisis happened. It was basically
destiny.

You knew the president -- you knew that then Senator Obama was going
to win. This one, I would say, the president is clearly in a strong
position, but there are still potential twists here with the debate being
one of them. If Governor Romney has a good debate, he can change it. But
the problem here is he`s running a bad campaign. He`s a bad candidate with
bad policies. And how do you turn that around in one debate? I`m not sure
it`s possible.

SCHULTZ: Well, Chris, he`s got all these internal numbers now that
they`re banking on. They`ve got to be feeling good about their internal
numbers. Every campaign has internal numbers. You know how it is. How
does he turn it around? We`ve played a big segment tonight on Ohio. I
think he had that Mr. Rowe up there with the hat on and the working man
look to try to appease the problem when it came to the 47 percent.

How does he turn this around? And where does he turn it around?
Where does he really have to focus?

KOFINIS: Here`s what I think is interesting about this election. It
started off, you know, as most elections do for incumbents, as a
referendum. But then it became clearly a choice. Now it`s become a
referendum again, but not on President Obama. It`s become a referendum on
Governor Romney and his policies and his statements and his vision, and his
just, I think, basic outlook for the country, for hard-working families.

I`m not sure how he changes that. He`s got to go into that debate,
because it really is the one defining moment that`s left for him. He`s got
to go into that debate and show an empathetic side that we have not seen.
He`s got to show a vision and substance that we have not seen. And he`s
got to rock the president. And I don`t believe any of those things can
happen in one debate.

And if he doesn`t, the stink of death is going to materialize around
this campaign. At that time, they`re going to say, listen, he didn`t win
that debate. This is more or less over.

SCHULTZ: All right. Chris Kofinis, great to have you with us
tonight. Appreciate your time on THE ED SHOW.

Coming up, now that the deadline has passed for Todd Akin to withdraw
from his Senate race in Missouri, look at this, some Republicans are making
peace and getting behind his campaign. Will the RNC follow suit? Stay
tuned.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCHULTZ: Welcome back to THE ED SHOW. Not to say that I told you so,
but I knew I was going to be doing this story before too long. Since
making national headlines with his legitimate rape comment, Congressman
Todd Akin has been walking a lonely road in the Missouri Senate race
against Claire McCaskill, the incumbent.

Top national Republicans, what did they do? Well, they urged him to
step down. Republican groups pulled funds from his race. Last week, the
chair of the RNC said Akin won`t receive any support from the party. But
he continues to win the support of some big-name Republican rebels, I guess
you could say. Earlier this week, it was former House Speaker Newt
Gingrich.

Today, former presidential candidate Rick Santorum in South Carolina,
Senator Jim DeMint got together endorsing Akin in a joint statement. And
now that the deadline for Akin to withdraw from the race has passed, it`s
looking like Republicans may have no choice but to fall in line behind his
campaign in a last-ditch effort to oust Claire McCaskill and maybe grab the
Senate, which for some means they`re just going to have to do a flat-out
180.

Senator Roy Blunt was one of the many politicians who publicly urged
Akin to get out of here.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. ROY BLUNT (R), MISSOURI: You know, I think it`s a distraction
and "the Wall Street Journal" again this morning said Todd needs to get out
of this race, because the things he`s for are actually being held back by
all the focus on him and some comments he`s made.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: But late Tuesday night, just after the 5:00 p.m. deadline,
Blunt issued a statement announcing his support for the congressman.
"Congressman Akin and I don`t agree on everything, but he and I agree the
Senate majority must change. From Governor Romney to the county
courthouse, I`ll be working for the Republican ticket in Missouri. And
that includes Todd Akin."

Dog gone it. And Blunt isn`t the only one changing his tune. The
National Republican Senatorial Campaign, which has previously said that it
would not spend money to help him elect, released a statement saying that
we`re going to support the guy.

Which begs the question, will the national -- will the Republican
National Committee -- that`s you, Reince Priebus, right? Won`t you follow
suit and embrace Todd Akin? Come on.

And how long is it going to be before Mitt Romney flip-flops on this
one?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ROMNEY: I can`t defend what he said. I can`t defend him.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Until when? Tonight in our survey, I asked you, who will
win Ohio? Ninety eight percent of you say President Obama; two percent of
you say Mitt Romney.

Coming up, new polling shows President Obama gaining on Mitt Romney in
the red state of Arizona. Plus, outgoing Senator Jon Kyl`s Senate seat
could be turning blue. We`re going to be talking to Democratic Senate
candidate trying to win his seat, next. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCHULTZ: And in the Big Finish tonight, the red state of Arizona
could be changing colors. New polling from Purple Strategies shows Mitt
Romney with only a three-point lead over President Obama. Back in 2008,
the Obama campaign thought they had a shot at Arizona if Senator John
McCain had not been on the top of the ticket.

There is also an open Senate seat in the state of Arizona that is now
in play. Outgoing Republican Senator Jon Kyl`s seat could be turning from
red to blue. The Republican candidate for Senate is Congressman Jeff
Flake. He leads Democrat challenger Richard Carmona by only one point in a
Carmona campaign internal poll.

Now, Congressman Flake is a typical Republican in Speaker Boehner`s
failing House of Representatives. He wants to repeal Obamacare, the
Affordable Care Act. He`s against same-sex marriage. He`s against a
woman`s right to choose. And the icing on the cake, he voted for Paul
Ryan`s, what some people call, immoral budget that completely guts Medicaid
and dismantles the social safety net in America.

His opponent, former George W. Bush Surgeon General Richard Carmona,
is taking the opposite approach.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RICHARD CARMONA (D), CANDIDATE FOR SENATE: It`s reprehensible to
think that the contract that we have with our seniors through Medicare or
Social Security is going to be cut. That doesn`t make any sense. These
are not entitlements. These are, in fact, investments. So I think that`s
the wrong thing to do.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Meanwhile, Flake is trying to tie Carmona to President
Obama.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Richard Carmona was recruited by Barack Obama.
Jeff Flake is supported by Jon Kyl and John McCain. Carmona is for Obama`s
health care law. Flake`s against Obama`s health care law.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Joining me now is Dr. Richard Carmona, Democratic candidate
for Senate in Arizona and the former surgeon general of the United States.
Doctor, nice to meet you. Great to have you here on THE ED SHOW tonight.

I`ll go right to it. Health care is in your wheelhouse. You are the
expert. He`s going after you -- your opponent`s going after you on
Obamacare. But you have been critical of health care in general on both
sides. Where do you stand on all of this?

CARMONA: Well, as surgeon general, Ed, I was very clear, and I still
feel the same way, as a physician, as a professor, when I responsibility
for the nation`s health. It was a real problem that our nation didn`t have
a system that provided access to health care for all, and we need a robust
business plan to be able to support that.

So that`s where I stand and I`ll never waiver from the fact that I
believe that every American should have access to a basic set of health
care benefits.

SCHULTZ: Well, you`ve got a lot of senior citizens in the state of
Arizona. How does this play -- how do you play with them and is this going
to be your ticket?

CARMONA: Well, I don`t have any specific ticket. I mean, I fall back
on a life long history of service. Having been a policeman, having been a
soldier, having been a combat soldier, U.S. Army Special Forces, having
been a surgeon general of the United States, a professor at a university.
So all of these things are really things that I have worked with all my
life and I`ve had the privilege to serve.

SCHULTZ: Senate seats don`t open up too often in the state of
Arizona. In fact, there`s only been 10 senators in Arizona`s 100-year
history. Why do you think you have a shot at this one?

CARMONA: I think I have a good shot. In the last 10 months as I`ve
been running for the U.S. Senate, I`ve traveled the state and I`ve spoken
to average persons. I`ve spoken to Native Americans on the reservation.
I`ve spoken to business people, bankers. Most of the people I speak to are
very unhappy with the lack of leadership that Jeff Flake has shown in his
position as a congressman.

Businessmen tell me, time and time again, that he`s against everything
and for nothing. He`s not willing to compromise. He takes extreme
positions. So I think they`re desperate for real leadership. And I can
provide that leadership for them.

SCHULTZ: And there`s a third party libertarian candidate. Is this
going to help you?

CARMONA: I don`t know. I haven`t really thought about it. I`ve
heard about this person. But the fact is that working real hard, staying
positive on my messages, showing the public the differences between
Congressman Flake and I, and we`re tied. And nobody ever expected that to
happen. So I`m very pleased with the team I put together who has taught me
to be a good candidate.

SCHULTZ: And we know in the past year, the state of Arizona has been
the hotbed of conversation and legislation when it comes to immigration,
the Show Me Your Papers Law, all of the controversy that surrounded all of
that. Immigration reform hot in your state. How do you differ from
Congressman Flake on this issue?

CARMONA: Well, I can tell you how I feel about it very simply. The
problem is Congressman Flake has changed multiple times, especially after
he decided to become a senator. You know, he ran a very tough primary and
you have to move far to the right. And now he`s trying to show people he`s
a moderate, which he really isn`t.

The fact is I`ve been steadfast in my beliefs as the surgeon general
of the United States and thereafter. I thought that Senator Kennedy and
President Bush had a great plan in this pathway to citizenship, earned
citizenship, and not disadvantaging the children and allowing us to have a
DREAM Act. I still believe that`s the path forward. We still have to
negotiate how it`s done.

But It`s the most reasonable way to settle this divisive battle that
brings no value to the American public.

SCHULTZ: I want to get back to health care, if I may, because that is
your strength and you`re the expert on it. We`ve only got a few seconds
left. Do you believe in universal health care? Do you believe every
American should have it?

CARMONA: As I said in the opening remarks, Ed, I do believe that
every American should have access to a basic set of health care benefits.
I am OK with the marketplace. I`m OK with competition. In fact, if you
look at almost every plan in the last few years and what we do in our
states now, what we call Accountable Care Organizations -- let`s measure
what we do. Let`s make everybody more accountable.

Let`s get quality care at the least cost, but let`s make sure every
citizen has access to the best care at the least cost.

SCHULTZ: All right. Richard Carmona, great to have you with us
tonight. All the best. Thanks so much.

CARMONA: Thank you, Ed.

SCHULTZ: That`s THE ED SHOW. I`m Ed Schultz. "THE RACHEL MADDOW
SHOW" starts right now. Good evening, Rachel.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY
BE UPDATED.
END

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